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Re: Reaction to Dumbing Us Down By John 04/25/02 12:56:09 PM

Date: 04/25/02 12:56:09 PM
Name: John
Email: sueandjohn711@juno.com
Subject: Re: Reaction to Dumbing Us Down
I'm really surprised that someone reading Dumbing Us Down is left inspired to teach. You mentioned that your students were inured by their years of schooling . . . that they had had the life sucked out of them and gave lackluster responses to your teaching. Listen to what you are saying; it will be the same everywhere you are likely, or even remotely likely, to teach. What I thought as I read Dumbing Us Down last fall was, well, I can't hide the truth from myself any longer, school really is jail and I am a jailkeeper.

Count yourself lucky that you don't have your certificate and won't be sucked into the schooling system any further than you already are. Build meaningful relationships with kids outside of school. Enjoy mathematics yourself and don't impose your love of it on the captive audience at your local high school.

Replying to:
I wish I had time to include in this message the stories I have collected over the past few months as a substitute teacher--and to explain how I became a teacher in the first place. Suffice it to say that I became a teacher because I wanted to use the talents I have to help kids learn and grow, to discover their potential and their dreams, and to develop their potential and pursue their dreams.

Which is way too idealistic for anyone teaching in a public school, right? Which is one of the reasons why the only school that ever hired me was a private school. (The other reason is that I do not have a teacher's certificate. I majored in English as a writer, not a teacher.) Unfortunately, the school closed less than a year after I was hired (long story).

But that school taught me something. I applied to the school to teach English. But what they ended up needing was a math teacher--no one else on staff wanted to tackle algebra and geometry. Fortunately, I was a good math student in high school. So I took on the challenge--and I quickly developed a fascination with math. As a teacher, I saw patterns and tricks in the problems that I had never seen as a student. I saw new and different ways to work problems out that my teachers never taught me. And I realized that this was something I loved doing, and wanted to continue doing.

But the students I was teaching had been inured to school by too many years already spent in other schools that sucked the life out of them, their dreams, and their belief in themselves. Frustrated by their lackluster reaction to my teaching, I began to read any book I could find on education.

And I continued reading, even after the school closed. Alfie Kohn, Parker Palmer, George Wood--each author seemed to hold one piece of the puzzle, but I had yet to find a solution that I could undertake as an individual.

And I missed teaching, so last December, I applied to the local city and county school systems to be a substitute teacher.

It had been ten years since I had spent any time in public schools. They had been a place of terror for me, as I suffered daily verbal harassment from my classmates. So on my first day of substitute teaching, I entered the classroom with great trepidation.

But I left feeling frustrated. The frustration only grew and soon developed into anger as I visited school after school. As I watched the activity around me--the attitudes of students and adults, their interaction, the lack of respect on both sides--I kept muttering to myself, "This is insane. Any open-minded adult should be able to see how insane this is."

But in my reading, I had not yet found an author who was willing to admit just how insane schools were...until I read Gatto's _Dumbing Us Down._

I read the entire book in three days. I read sections out loud to my parents, who are both teachers (of adults). Many times, while reading, I wanted to jump up and down and scream, "Exactly! That's exactly how it is!"

I agree wholeheartedly that the certification requirements for schools should be dropped. I want desperately to teach. I know that I'm good at it. I feel that I have a gift for translating difficult subjects into terms that students can understand.

But without that precious piece of paper, most schools will not look at me. More importantly (since I want to teach high school students), I cannot get certified in math--where I feel I could do the most good--because I do not have a math degree. Never mind that fact that I already have experience teaching math, and I'm good at it. Again, without the necessary piece of paper, I can't do anything!

And to get that piece of paper, I have to go back to school--and since I am an adult student, it's very difficult to find scholarships. And I'm already in debt, so I don't want to take out more loans! So even trying to get the precious piece of paper that will let me teach (many private schools here in North Carolina also require certification--I checked) will cost money (that I don't have) and take several additional years of study.

All of which seems like a huge waste to me. All I want to do is teach. I'm good at it. But it doesn't matter how good I am if I don't have one little precious piece of paper!

I'm open to suggestions...and to sharing more of my stories. Thanks for "listening."

Re: Re: Reaction to Dumbing Us Down By KB 04/26/02 12:25:25 PM

Date: 04/26/02 12:25:25 PM
Name: KB
Email: nc_horses@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Re: Reaction to Dumbing Us Down
Your response to the book was to say, "Well, you're right--so I shouldn't do this anymore." My response to the book is to say, "Well, you're right--so someone needs to do something."

The reality is that government schooling is not going to go away any time soon. I would rather be in the school, fighting for innovations and creativity, fighting the rules, fighting for the kids, than sitting back and just shaking my head at the whole thing.

Parents can have an impact on their kids through the choices they make for their kids. But I'm not a parent. I believe the best way I can make a difference in kids' lives is to try to touch as many lives as I can.

Imposing my love of math on the kids? Hardly! I am an English major--I have been a writer for twenty years--but I am, in fact, now on a path to becoming a math teacher. Not because I love math--I don't--but because I believe that the kids deserve to have a math teacher who is more interested in helping them learn than in the subject itself. I don't care if the kids love math or not--but I certainly don't want them to hate it or dread it. They'll need some of those math skills in life, and they'll definitely need the critical thinking and problem-solving skills that learning math requires.

I'm not about to tell anyone else, "You should do this or that." My decisions are my own. And what I have chosen to do is to step into the trenches--knowing the dangers and frustrations that may be ahead--and, if necessary, put my professional life on the line to make a difference.

My reason for teaching has nothing to do with my ego; it has everything to do with my love for high school students, and my empathy and concern for them. Most people appear not to care about these kids; I do, and I will do whatever I can to help them. I am not in this to feel better about myself; I am not interested in avoiding frustration and pain altogether. I am interested in making a difference. I will risk anything for the sake of the students--I have faced successes and failures in my life, and I have survived, so I am no longer afraid to try. I am willing to put it all on the line--I have nothing left to lose in my life. But the kids have so much to gain--if people are willing to fight for them.

I've already decided to get my certification, and I have, this week, found a way to do it. It will take three years--but that's a small price to pay for the sake of the students.

The medium is the message By SL Blondeau 04/26/02 05:03:58 PM
Date: 04/26/02 05:03:58 PM
Name: SL Blondeau
Email: lincolnsylvester@hotmail.com
Subject: The medium is the message
All that fighting and touching student's lives sounds awfully taxing.
If one hundred fifty years ago you happened to be a plantation owner who genuinely cared for his slaves, would it still have been okay to own slaves?
Replying to:
Your response to the book was to say, "Well, you're right--so I shouldn't do this anymore." My response to the book is to say, "Well, you're right--so someone needs to do something."

The reality is that government schooling is not going to go away any time soon. I would rather be in the school, fighting for innovations and creativity, fighting the rules, fighting for the kids, than sitting back and just shaking my head at the whole thing.

Parents can have an impact on their kids through the choices they make for their kids. But I'm not a parent. I believe the best way I can make a difference in kids' lives is to try to touch as many lives as I can.

Imposing my love of math on the kids? Hardly! I am an English major--I have been a writer for twenty years--but I am, in fact, now on a path to becoming a math teacher. Not because I love math--I don't--but because I believe that the kids deserve to have a math teacher who is more interested in helping them learn than in the subject itself. I don't care if the kids love math or not--but I certainly don't want them to hate it or dread it. They'll need some of those math skills in life, and they'll definitely need the critical thinking and problem-solving skills that learning math requires.

I'm not about to tell anyone else, "You should do this or that." My decisions are my own. And what I have chosen to do is to step into the trenches--knowing the dangers and frustrations that may be ahead--and, if necessary, put my professional life on the line to make a difference.

My reason for teaching has nothing to do with my ego; it has everything to do with my love for high school students, and my empathy and concern for them. Most people appear not to care about these kids; I do, and I will do whatever I can to help them. I am not in this to feel better about myself; I am not interested in avoiding frustration and pain altogether. I am interested in making a difference. I will risk anything for the sake of the students--I have faced successes and failures in my life, and I have survived, so I am no longer afraid to try. I am willing to put it all on the line--I have nothing left to lose in my life. But the kids have so much to gain--if people are willing to fight for them.

I've already decided to get my certification, and I have, this week, found a way to do it. It will take three years--but that's a small price to pay for the sake of the students.

Ouch By Stan 04/28/02 10:17:29 AM

Date: 04/28/02 10:17:29 AM
Name: Stan
Email: staneandrus@cs.com
Subject: Ouch
Ouch Ouch Ouch SL You just made me FURTHER reconsider my teaching career (7+ years so far) Thanks for makeing ME think.
Stan